Curse

Str0b0 · Nov 29, 2007, 11:15 PM // 23:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lima

lol yea, 1 in 5 casts with perf mod, that's how often...

which when you are casting on recharge an echo'd SS happens a lot more often than you would think. It only takes one or two 43 damage SS casts to make a big difference since it applies to the enemy it was cast on and all adjacent.

Lima · Nov 29, 2007, 11:21 PM // 23:21

i know how ss works, i do use it lol. your idea is correct though, over a ranged period of time with possible chances of +19 ss, the damage is considerably more than that of +18... and i mean if you have a staff that's +1 curses with a 20% chance, then why not use it? it's not like you need the other mods for anything else so it's a good choice of mod

Sab · Nov 29, 2007, 11:46 PM // 23:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

because not everyone that plays mesmer plays FC curse or nuke.

The discussion right now is about whether or not a Mesmer can use a Necro bar better than a Necro.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

10 pips of energy regen? one, where do you get those numbers, two, mesmers have the best energy management skills in the game, necros have built in handicaps.

Soul Reaping at 10 spec (9 + minor rune) gives 10e per death. Over a maximum of 3 kills every 15s, that's 30e every 15s, or 2e every second. That equals 6 pips (plus the +4 base regen of a caster). Add in Signet of Lost Souls and you have energy management that's stronger than the Mesmer's, requires only one skill slot, and is arguably less conditional and easier to use.

Lima · Nov 29, 2007, 11:49 PM // 23:49

amen, play a mesmer for a mesmer, necro for a necro, etc etc

Magikarp · Nov 30, 2007, 12:13 AM // 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sab

The discussion right now is about whether or not a Mesmer can use a Necro bar better than a Necro.

sorry i missed that bus, seeing as the op clearly asked, "Is Mesmer worth it?"

Quote:

Soul Reaping at 10 spec (9 + minor rune) gives 10e per death. Over a maximum of 3 kills every 15s, that's 30e every 15s, or 2e every second. That equals 6 pips (plus the +4 base regen of a caster). Add in Signet of Lost Souls and you have energy management that's stronger than the Mesmer's, requires only one skill slot, and is arguably less conditional and easier to use.

channeling is best energy managment skill in the game. ether phantom/drain delusions doubles as some of the best emangement and energy denial in pvp.

necros get a cute handicap, and tons of energy to cast wads of hexes or minions, mesmers create massive problems for any class in pvp, not just melee, and in pve, can run any casters bar just as good, with the exception of monk. its pve. the only time necros are any threat in pvp, is when they're in some gimmick hexspam build like euro, and even then, a good team can put a stop to that really quick. remember, you have to kill something for your energy, other classes dont, and if you dont rely on SR or SoLS, you need mesmer 2nds to back you up.

Omniclasm · Nov 30, 2007, 12:14 AM // 00:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

channeling is best energy managment skill in the game. ether phantom/drain delusions doubles as some of the best emangement and energy denial in pvp.

necros get a cute handicap, and tons of energy to cast wads of hexes or minions, mesmers create massive problems for any class in pvp, not just melee, and in pve, can run any casters bar just as good, with the exception of monk. its pve. the only time necros are any threat in pvp, is when they're in some gimmick hexspam build like euro, and even then, a good team can put a stop to that really quick. remember, you have to kill something for your energy, other classes dont, and if you dont rely on SR or SoLS, you need mesmer 2nds to back you up.

A 2 paragraphs of fail.

Sab · Nov 30, 2007, 01:00 AM // 01:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

sorry i missed that bus, seeing as the op clearly asked, "Is Mesmer worth it?"

I don't know how you could've possibly missed that bus when you yourself have been comparing Mesmer abilities vs other professions over the last few pages. Please read back if you've forgotten what you've typed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

channeling is best energy managment skill in the game. ether phantom/drain delusions doubles as some of the best emangement and energy denial in pvp.

Channeling is good in HA, that's about it. Assuming you're talking about PvE, you have to wander in the frontline to get decent returns, drawing unnecessary aggro. Ether Phantom/Drain Delusions in PvP isn't relevant here so I won't discuss why it's not that good (and it's downright useless in PvE).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

necros get a cute handicap, and tons of energy to cast wads of hexes or minions, mesmers create massive problems for any class in pvp, not just melee, and in pve, can run any casters bar just as good, with the exception of monk. its pve. the only time necros are any threat in pvp, is when they're in some gimmick hexspam build like euro, and even then, a good team can put a stop to that really quick. remember, you have to kill something for your energy, other classes dont, and if you dont rely on SR or SoLS, you need mesmer 2nds to back you up.

- Necros with a Necro bar > Mesmer with a Necro bar. I've gone over the benefits of a Mesmer primary (none) vs a Necro primary (14-spec, Soul Reaping) in my previous post.
- We're talking about PvE. PvP is not relevant in this discussion.
- In PvE, if you don't kill anything, the problem rests on your party sucking rather than the Soul Reaping cap. If you're in a good group, Soul Reaping and SoLS are reliable sources of energy.
- If a Necro needs his secondary for energy management, he'd go /E for Glyph of Lesser Energy. It require no attribute investment and is more reliable on a human player than Inspiration stuff.

Magikarp · Nov 30, 2007, 01:23 AM // 01:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omniclasm

A 2 paragraphs of fail.

another awesome troll post by omniclasm.

to sab, again, its called choice. i've never had a problem getting groups, never had a problem in HM, and have had much more fun, and a sense of accomplishment with my mesmer, than i've ever had with my necro.

i could care less about soul reaping. if you cant manage energy, dont play a caster class. and the "bad returns" argument about channeling in pve is one of the worst debates i've ever heard. even 5 energy, from 5 destroyers of sinew rushing in your backline is better than waiting for death so you can spam SS some more. granted, once death is accomplished, you get your free treat bag of energy, but you didnt have to do anything to earn it, or even know anything about the game other than to slap some points in the att line. if you dont like mesmers, fine, but in my opinion, mesmers are more than worth the extra work of learning how to actually play guild wars.

Omniclasm · Nov 30, 2007, 01:59 AM // 01:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

another awesome troll post by omniclasm.

Another hiding from the truth with the "troll" word by Magikarp.

arsie · Nov 30, 2007, 02:24 AM // 02:24

They get lingerie for elite armour, that has got to count for something.

On the serious side, the majority of players would interrupt slower than NPC mesmers, but at least some of them will be able to select which spells to interrupt. I always throw a cheap spell to pre-cancel the mob interrupt so it doesn't go to my main course 2-3 second cast spells. Then again, mobs also like to start big.

Pre-cast interrupts are nice and annoying and easy to use. I reckon a mesmer can pretty much mitigate as much damage as any build designed for that same purpose.

You're either fighting for a party spot with a Curse necro and Nuker or againsts Paragons and Prot Monks. :O

Or both.

Magikarp · Nov 30, 2007, 02:34 AM // 02:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omniclasm

Another hiding from the truth with the "troll" word by Magikarp.

im not sure how you manage to escape the ban stick in every thread you hijack, but you really make it hard for other people to have a normal conversation. you almost never give any real input to a debate, and moreso, you flame and troll like no other user on these forums. you're very annoying kid.

this thread is about opinion. the question is whether or not us players find mesmers "worth it". its in the campfire section, so it can only be assumed its for pve, because this is a pve forum, and moreso, we all know mesmers are one of the most important pvp classes.

for pve, while entirely gimped as a class, the mesmer has a huge job of trying to fit himself into the realm of the eviroment he/she will be faceing when dealing with their skill bar, but is ultimately just another class in the game, being really, just as good as you make them. i've seen collossal mesmers make pve a breeze, and i know myself, i had no problem ever making pve HM so much faster with my guild. on the other hand, i know that its a huge ordeal, and that other classes have it much easier, ergo the necro in a lot of these debates.

i enjoy the mesmer class (although i dont play them in pve anymore), and find their difficulty to play in pve a challenge that is worth the work, (especially if you have nothing else to do in the game :P) because in the end, seeing a mesmer in EotN pirate gear, or MGSORMohagany or up, is something you could get a lot of praise from the community for

thats my opinion, and im done posting on this thread, its overdone, overstated, and catching troll fever.

LightningHell · Nov 30, 2007, 02:56 AM // 02:56

No ad hominem fallacies, please.

Quote:

Channeling is good in HA, that's about it. Assuming you're talking about PvE, you have to wander in the frontline to get decent returns, drawing unnecessary aggro. Ether Phantom/Drain Delusions in PvP isn't relevant here so I won't discuss why it's not that good (and it's downright useless in PvE).

It's pretty bad in PvP as well.

Omniclasm · Nov 30, 2007, 03:59 AM // 03:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

im not sure how you manage to escape the ban stick in every thread you hijack, but you really make it hard for other people to have a normal conversation. you almost never give any real input to a debate, and moreso, you flame and troll like no other user on these forums. you're very annoying kid.

this thread is about opinion. the question is whether or not us players find mesmers "worth it". its in the campfire section, so it can only be assumed its for pve, because this is a pve forum, and moreso, we all know mesmers are one of the most important pvp classes.

for pve, while entirely gimped as a class, the mesmer has a huge job of trying to fit himself into the realm of the eviroment he/she will be faceing when dealing with their skill bar, but is ultimately just another class in the game, being really, just as good as you make them. i've seen collossal mesmers make pve a breeze, and i know myself, i had no problem ever making pve HM so much faster with my guild. on the other hand, i know that its a huge ordeal, and that other classes have it much easier, ergo the necro in a lot of these debates.

i enjoy the mesmer class (although i dont play them in pve anymore), and find their difficulty to play in pve a challenge that is worth the work, (especially if you have nothing else to do in the game :P) because in the end, seeing a mesmer in EotN pirate gear, or MGSORMohagany or up, is something you could get a lot of praise from the community for

thats my opinion, and im done posting on this thread, its overdone, overstated, and catching troll fever.

Except 90% of my posts do in fact have a point, even though you blindly disagree with me, and refuse to accept fact. You call me a troll just because I make sense when I post, and it isn't just "You are not skilled enough to understand the Mesmer".

Your only input in this discussion has been that inexperienced people think Mesmers suck for PvE, and that Mesmers make better Necromancers than Necromancers do. Both of your points are false.

So how do you exit the discussion? Calling people who proved you wrong a troll, just like you did last time, and guess what? I was right last time, and I am also right this time.

Magikarp · Nov 30, 2007, 04:17 AM // 04:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omniclasm

Except 90% of my posts do in fact have a point, even though you blindly disagree with me, and refuse to accept fact. You call me a troll just because I make sense when I post, and it isn't just "You are not skilled enough to understand the Mesmer".

Your only input in this discussion has been that inexperienced people think Mesmers suck for PvE, and that Mesmers make better Necromancers than Necromancers do. Both of your points are false.

So how do you exit the discussion? Calling people who proved you wrong a troll, just like you did last time, and guess what? I was right last time, and I am also right this time.

life must just be a game to you as well. "last time i was right too"? are you ten years old? or just a total child about everything? you're trolling, you've been called out by tons of people on it before, and yet again, you've mad yourself look silly. i posted a final time, to end disputes, yet you continue to complain like a little kid because you're upset about me calling you out as a troll. first off, inexperienced people typically DO think mesmers are bad for pve, one, because they dont know their use, and two, because people tell them they are. also, i never EVER said necros "suck" for pve, and in fact, if you read my post, said they're very good for pve, and in fact BETTER than a necro, and much easier to play.

learn to read kid, and grow up while you're at it.

Omniclasm · Nov 30, 2007, 04:25 AM // 04:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

life must just be a game to you as well. "last time i was right too"? are you ten years old? or just a total child about everything? you're trolling, you've been called out by tons of people on it before, and yet again, you've mad yourself look silly. i posted a final time, to end disputes, yet you continue to complain like a little kid because you're upset about me calling you out as a troll. first off, inexperienced people typically DO think mesmers are bad for pve, one, because they dont know their use, and two, because people tell them they are. also, i never EVER said necros "suck" for pve, and in fact, if you read my post, said they're very good for pve, and in fact BETTER than a necro, and much easier to play.

learn to read kid, and grow up while you're at it.

You brought up the previous thread before I did...

Quote the tons of people calling me a troll?

Yeah, you "end the disputes" with an insult...and you call me childish?

I never said that you said necromancers "suck" for PvE....you did say that Mesmers are better at it.

Insult after insult....it is quite amusing m8.

Magikarp · Nov 30, 2007, 04:35 AM // 04:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omniclasm

You brought up the previous thread before I did...

Quote the tons of people calling me a troll?

Yeah, you "end the disputes" with an insult...and you call me childish?

I never said that you said necromancers "suck" for PvE....you did say that Mesmers are better at it.

Insult after insult....it is quite amusing m8.

quote where i said mesmers are better at pve. also, calling you childish when you're purposly trying to start arguments, is a statement, not an insult. go to the other thread, and look at the people calling troll on you, and also, im done talking to you, you're not worth my time. this thread is way past done.

Omniclasm · Nov 30, 2007, 04:41 AM // 04:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

quote where i said mesmers are better at pve. also, calling you childish when you're purposly trying to start arguments, is a statement, not an insult. go to the other thread, and look at the people calling troll on you, and also, im done talking to you, you're not worth my time. this thread is way past done.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...8&postcount=60

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...4&postcount=58

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...9&postcount=73

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...0&postcount=92

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...9&postcount=94

Magikarp · Nov 30, 2007, 04:47 AM // 04:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omniclasm

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...8&postcount=60

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...4&postcount=58

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...9&postcount=73

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...0&postcount=92

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...9&postcount=94

and any of those say "mesmers are better in pve than necros" where? they simply say that a mesmer can play a necro bar, just like a necro can play a mesmer bar, with near-same results. necros get built in energy supplies, mesmers cast anything necros offer, faster, and depending on the build, more than a necro can.

putting words in my mouth is really mature. this entire thread has been me simply saying, mesmers are worth the trouble of dealing with negative people in the community like you. they're essential in pvp, unlike a necro, and fun in pve, just like any other class. in pve, no class is better than the other imo.

Omniclasm · Nov 30, 2007, 04:50 AM // 04:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magikarp

and any of those say "mesmers are better in pve than necros" where? they simply say that a mesmer can play a necro bar, just like a necro can play a mesmer bar, with near-same results. necros get built in energy supplies, mesmers cast anything necros offer, faster, and depending on the build, more than a necro can.

putting words in my mouth is really mature. this entire thread has been me simply saying, mesmers are worth the trouble of dealing with negative people in the community like you. they're essential in pvp, unlike a necro, and fun in pve, just like any other class. in pve, no class is better than the other imo.

Quote:

both shame and guilt stop skills that you cant normally stop on your own, and mesmers use any necro skill just as good as a necro, but faster,

Quote:

except a mesmer would cast enfeebling faster, and depending on the build, have way more utility to offer.

Quote:

so why couldnt a mesmer use the same skill, faster, with the same results? 6 less damage is not a big deal at all.

Hmmm.........

Edit: Forgot one

Quote:

and btw, curse "utility" is nothing compaired to the utility of domination, and self utility of inspiration. curses offers a few great skills, and a ton of overrated hexes that have made the whole class a very button-mashing style type of class. i still rather have a mesmer. guess thats just me. not like i care.

Magikarp · Nov 30, 2007, 04:57 AM // 04:57

so? isnt that what FC does????? it makes you cast spells FASTER. you really have no argument at all do you? do you want to stir up trouble? i dont understand your reasoning, and moreso, why you can't drop something so trivial.